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Late Radoms

7K views 42 replies 15 participants last post by  cpw 
#1 · (Edited)
At the SOS show in February, I acquired:



The first is a 2nd K Radom with two late P38 style mags, 623 marked. The pistol is close to the end of the known serial number range. It came with the proper holster.


The second is a phosphate bnz. It will go with my blued bnz and my 2 blank slide Radoms. I had more trouble finding the phosphate bnz than I did with the other three.


The third is a 2nd H Radom with the grooved wood grips. 2nd H Radoms have been seen with the grooved wood grips and a phosphate type finish. The known ones have been in the higher serial number portion of the 2nd H range. This is a low number and surprised a couple of collectors at the SOS show.

(Been busy and keep forgetting to post.)
 

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#5 ·
I get to see his stuff in the flesh. Enjoyed the SOS with you and thanks again. Wow on those rare pieces of history. Great Charlie! Please drop me an email and let me know how you are doing.

If he does a display, make all efforts to attend the show. You will be amazed. Typically those are at NGD, Tulsa and Greenville, SC.
 
#6 ·
It was three years ago when I had a chance to see your HP collection,which was absolutely amazing.Same time You had a small fraction of Radoms on a display,very impressive.I can not wait to see you complete Radoms display.Take Mikes advice and try to see it.Very nice pistols above.Regards Kris
 
#10 ·
At the Greenville show two years ago (I think), I had a display of early and late Radoms. (Not the middle ones.) I like the late Radoms - I guess because of the fact that the Germans were able to turn them out even with the Russians knocking at the door and the Allied bombing.

- - - Updated - - -

I get to see his stuff in the flesh. Enjoyed the SOS with you and thanks again. Wow on those rare pieces of history. Great Charlie! Please drop me an email and let me know how you are doing.

If he does a display, make all efforts to attend the show. You will be amazed. Typically those are at NGD, Tulsa and Greenville, SC.
Getting better.
 
#8 · (Edited)
* That late 2/K pistol in the 2nd Pic is really the rare one. Don't think I've ever seen a L/Handed Radom before. And even the same mirrored image S/N as its R/Handed brother in Pic #1.....ROTF...LOL !! Anyway, glad I could be point dog on your late 2/K hunt.
* You certainly had a Show of all Shows that day.
 
#9 ·
Good eye. You see what happens when (1) one is in a hurry and (2) sadly I am not a good photographer.

- - - Updated - - -

Back in the 90s there was a super display of High Power pistols at the Ohio Gun Collector's Association shows when it was still located in Cleveland. I wonder whether it was Anthony's or Charlie's perhaps?
It was not Anthony's.
 
#15 ·
Charlie....congrats on your latest pickups. I wasn't at the that show but was at another show locally last week and past on a 2nd K block. the guy wanted 2850 for it but it only came with 1 mag and no holster. and I wasn't sure but thought that was a little high. other than that it appeared correct except that one had a blued slide stop which I read was known to happen. so to find a complete rig is just amazing and then along with a BNZ marked one! you did very well....
 
#17 ·
Mike...thanks for the reply.....that is sorta what I was thinking but they come up so little I wasn't sure if I hadn't been keeping up with price increases. About a year ago I paid 2400 for a pre-alpha rig. so I was expecting to pay around 2800 for a K block but again thought I could get a rig for that not just the gun. Its amazing the prices of these some times. I sure hope we are not in a bubble like the stock market. I keep wondering when things will level off.
 
#29 ·
Good numbers Leszek and they are not that inconsistent with either my guesses nor Charlie's. We are all in the ball park. We need more data for it to be even more meaningful. I suspect you do not have all of Charlie's 50 plus 2/k block examples. He has not put them out there for the most part. 2/A block phosphate would be interesting. I have only seen 2, my friend Francis has them. 2/J like 6 known. I think, but can not definitely recall, but I think Charlie has a 2/C phosphate??

Did you get my examples from this forum? They are all posted. I have had 2 of the 2/B and 2 of the 2/K in phosphate. One 2/B was traded a while back and the grip safety was mismatched but there was no sign the gun had ever been apart and condition was high.
 
#30 ·
hello,
Gentleman,You both(Mike and Leszek)missing Charlies point.He clearly said that 2nd alphabet blued Bs,WITH EAGLE 626 stamped on the trigger guard are more rare then phosphate with the same stamp on the trigger guard.Regards Kris.About 'mugbook'.It is helpful,it was in a few occasions,why wont we updated and give few more undocumented numbers for Leszek
 
#31 ·
Do all of the Bs you mentioned have 623 on the trigger guard? I have seen some without the 623 on the trigger guard. (I actually have one w/o the 623. I have passed up a couple of other ones that did not have the 623.)


2Ks - I have 17 - only 3 of which are blue. I know of a couple of other blue ones, but between the Tulsa, NGD, SCACA, MVACA, OGCA, AGCA, SOS shows, the various auction houses, and the websites of Scotty, Tom (Tom did have a 2B phosphate 623 marked one (in the 6000 range) a bit back that was within the range of the numbers of mine), and Dave ------ I have not seen the % of 623 marked blues that you have.


I have 3 - 2nd alphabet “H” that are phosphate with the grooved wood grips. Not 623 marked on trigger guard.


I have a 2nd alphabet “A” phosphate, but it does not have the 623 on the trigger guard.


My list shows a 2nd alphabet “D” that is phosphate with the grooved wood grips and has 623 on the trigger guard. (I am going to have to find it and make sure that I did not record it wrong.)


What is the mugbook?


Right now everything is a mess as it is hard to walk thru the gun area. Besides my mess, my son came from California on his way to WP. (From WP he was going to DC, then to Andrews.) He left all of his firearms here at my house as he is going to be in Beirut for a year. Plus he left all of his personal belongings (other than what would fit in 2 bags. So I have a living room that is filed with boxes (with only a path), plus closets that are filled, etc. So it may take time to look for the 2/D as I have to straighten out the gun area so that I do not trip on bags, etc.
.
 
#35 ·
What is the mugbook?
That's my photo album showing all the Radoms I can place my paws upon, both in real physical sense or found somewhere on the web. I only record Radom numbers that I have corroborated by photo evidence. So far I got (by today's roll-call, courtesy of Excel chart) 4129 of these. I call it a Radom Mugbook, because (1) it shows my catch, just like a precinct book do; (2) quality of photographs in VERY uneven, and some individuals depicted there look a bit weird. Hence the mugbook.

Tell me about living with all your stuff in cartons :) I do that for the last 20 years, at the very least - so you have all my sympathy. Must be tough on a newcomer :p

My photo collection (aka the Mugbook) is to serve all collectors, so chipping in the serials and photos is very welcome. The regular contributors like andrew r., korona45, Kmicic or Squadron303 here may attest that I'm no fraudster preying on the serials to do any dirty tricks with them. I don't record any personal data in connection with these, and they are not intended for publication, unless clearly released (okay, zorro - that was one slip, and it would not repeat). These are for serious research only, and I do not release in public any data or photos that were clearly embargoed by the contributor. Therefore I repeat my plea two weeks old: cpw, may I have photos and serial of that blued bnz of yours? And all other Radoms, as we mention them. If you don't want to broadcast them here, contact me by PM.

All the best,
Leszek
 
#33 ·
Thanks for the data Charlie.

I understand what Charlie is saying Kris, I was saying his guess of blued 2/k of less than 10% and mine of less than 20% is not that far off the data. Charlie's collection has 17.6% blue but he has seen very few others. Leszek's data has 21% blue. I have seen a couple of Charlie's and one other. Looks like the actual number must be even smaller.

Both of my Phosphate 2/B had the 623 TG, Both my 2/K blocs are phosphate and have 623 on the TG. I can not find the number of on B but it was posted. B8337, k6468, K2325(mismatched barrel and slide in phosphate and match each other). Feel free to add them to the data/mugbooks whatever.

Charlie has 40% blue in 2/B and Leszek's data 51% blue. Interesting
 
#36 ·
Feel free to add them to the data/mugbooks whatever.
Mike, thanks a lot - but the mugbook has some rules. The first and foremost rule of the mugbook is - no mugshot, no glory. So, I'll very much appreciate photos of the pistols mentioned - and only then they could and would join the mubgook. There's no hurry, I'm not going anywhere, I don't have to have them by tomorrow, and they don't have to be world-class artiste photography, either. You really don't have to hire Man Ray (that would be tough, considering he's dead four decades this year) to do the pictures, a phone camera photo would suffice. The wider the base, the better chance to extract the right conclusions.

All the best,
Leszek
 
#40 ·
I had the Radoms early and late (not in between) at the Ohio Gun Collectors Assn 3 (?) years ago. At the Missouri Valley Arms Collectors Association perhaps 6/7 year ago (will not be going this year as I will be babysitting some grandkids). I had them at the South Carolina Arms Collectors October show either in 2013 or 2014. Not sure what I will be taking there this year - either Radoms or Hi Powers. The South Carolina show is hard on Radoms because Frances always displayed his there. But he has not done so for a few years now. I will have to check with K and get his opinion.
 
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