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Two lanyard loops - one from WW I "C. Hentschel, Dresden 1915" and one from WWII with code "clg 4" (?)

2K views 14 replies 8 participants last post by  infanterist2 
#1 ·
Hi there!
Want to share these pictures with you...
Two lanyard loops...
One from WWI "C. Hentschel Dresden 1915"





The other one was produced during WWII with the code "clg 4" or "clq 4".
By the way - I never knew that there are lanyard loops which were produced during WWII ???????????:confused:




Any comments are welcome!

Tom
 
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#4 ·
Tom, over the last 15 years or so I have studied and been interested in German Luger lanyards. I have made dozens..no more..posts about them on this very Forum as have dozens of other members. There are hundreds of posts about German Luger lanyards to be found in the 'search" topics. Simply go to the search box and type in German lanyard to read hours of opinions on this interesting subject!

Here you will find the most recent iteration of a reproduction Lanyard.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-WW2-...977531?hash=item51f55ebc7b:g:5IQAAOSwWxNYu3Pc

another..there are a half dozen to be found on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-WWII...157581?hash=item19f21cd28d:g:ip0AAOSwYHxWGFZX
 
#6 ·
Norm, I have yet to prove that a Portuguese lanyard actually exists. IF it does..and I have heard rumors..it is purported to be "woven" and I speculate this description to mean as in the whole length of it similar to the Polish lanyard. Or one sees this type or round weaving on Western 'bolo ties" I have never been able to observe ANY period photo's of a Portuguese lanyard in use. I have a small collection of German lanyard photo's and other members have found a few as well. There are quite a few photo's of Dutch lanyards in use.
When I first started to become interested in these rare Military artifacts a couple of decades ago there were none to be found in the USA. They were scarce to non existent. I contacted several very famous collectors in German & Belgium and they were very helpful in tracking down German lanyards in Europe and furnishing me with what information that was available in the many varied European collections they had access to. The type of lanyards that Tom shows in his initial posting were not on any radar 20 some years ago..although many lanyards were found and photographed they were all of the same type. I believe that type then, same as now, is the official German Military issue during the WW1 era..

In actuality the round leather shoulder strap and keeper found in Tom's photographs is a known lanyard for some foreign/other perhaps Reich revolver? pistol..it escapes me just which one but that is where the design for it and the weird slider/keepers. It was originally made with out and swivel or tab as that was not necessary on the LARGE ring found on the pistol.

If you take a close look at Toms pics, I have to wonder if the leather tongues meant to thread into the lanyard loop found on the Luger pistol will fit! They look awfully wide to me!

At any rate these foolish designs have been shamelessly reproduced, maker marked, dated and offered to the general public, too often as "original" with absolutely no basis for such an absurd claim. They are still offered on eBay as of today.

If anyone has a counter to my point I am anxious to hear it.
 
#8 ·
Jerry,

Found this site and some interesting photos. Portuguese troops in Africa during 1914-18.

http://www.portugalweb.net/historia/viriatus/Galeria_WWI_Africa.asp.htm

Too bad this one photo is not better to work with in terms of resolution...but it seems like some M2 holsters and possibly some lanyards.

And the 2nd. photo shows a smaller holstered pistol but with what looks like a braided-type lanyard.

There are a lot more photos to glean in the Uniforms sections.
.
.
 
#11 ·
As to the second lanyard (WWII), I own one almost identical. It has the same type swivel, rivets and attaching leather and snap. It has the maker's code and date - "CGU 4". At first, I thought it was for smaller pocket pistols like a police PPK, but the attaching loop is too wide for the smaller .32's. It passes thru the luger lanyard staple perfectly. It is old, well crafted leather that appears period.
Tim H.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Tom, Jerry hat sicher recht, wenn er die Fangriemen unter Fantasieprodukte einordnet. Zur P08 hat es keinen Fangriemen gegeben, sie werden weder im Armee- noch im Heeres Verordnungsblatt und auch nicht im Ministerialblatt für die Preußische innere Verwaltung erwähnt. Anders verhält es sich mit den Fangriemen für den Reichsrevolver und für die P38. Dazu gibt es Archivalien und sogar entsprechende Zeichnungen. Dieser Webriemen mit Schnalle konnte auch bei der P08 verwendet werden. Das wird ausdrücklich bei der Einführung des Fangiemens zur P38 erwähnt. Die Verordnung und die andere Archivalien habe ich schon wiederholt hier veröffentlicht.
Portugal hatte Fangriemen, sowohl für den Revolver, als auch für die 1943 an Portugal gelieferten Restbestände der P08 als byf 42. Neben den Fangriemen waren die Taschen aber auch aus Portugiesischer Produktion. Der Lederriemen ist im Bereich der Aufnahme mehr oder weniger kunstvoll geflochten. Der Abschluss ist einmal ein "Karabinerhaken für den Revolver und eine Lederlasche für die Parabellumpistole.
Während des Ersten Weltkrieges wurde alles mögliche als Fangriemen für die P08 verwendet. Ernst Jünger erwähnt es auch in "Stahlgewitter" und es gibt einige zeitgenössische Fotos, die die Trageweisen zeigen, offiziell waren die "Dinger" aber nicht. Häufig verwendet wurden auch die Brotbeutelriemen, wenn es um Stoßtrupp- Aktionen ging...
Die Fotos zeigen einige Fangriemen für den Reichs Revolver, die P38, die beiden Portugiesischen und einen Brotbeutenriemen.
 

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#13 ·
Tom, Jerry is certainly right when he arranges the fishing belts under fantasy products. There have been no catch belts for P08; they are not mentioned in the Army or Army Ordinance, nor in the Ministerial Gazette for the Prussian Internal Administration. The situation is different with the catch belts for the Reichsrevolver and the P38. In addition, there are archival materials and even drawings. This web belt with buckle could also be used with the P08. This is explicitly mentioned in the introduction of the P38 catch. I have already published the ordinance and the other archival material here several times.
Portugal had fishing boats, both for the revolver and for the remaining stocks of P08 delivered to Portugal in 1943 as byf 42. In addition to the catch belts, the bag was also made of Portuguese production. The leather strap is more or less artfully braided in the area of ​​the receptacle. The conclusion is once a "carabiner hook for the revolver and a leather flap for the parabolic pistol.
During the First World War everything was used as a catch belt for the P08. Ernst Jünger mentions it also in "Stahlgewitter" and there are some contemporary photos, which show the carrying ways, officially the "things" were not. Frequently used were also the bread bag straps when it came to battlegroup actions ...
The photos show some snags for the Reichs revolver, the P38, the two Portuguese and a Brotbeutenriemen.
 
#15 ·
Hallo Klaus!
Vielen Dank für die ausführliche Abhandlung.
Die Argumentation klingt zumindest plausibel...
Jetzt bin ich erst richtig neugierig geworden und werde gleich heute Abend in meiner Bibliothek auf die Suche gehen.
Ich meine, mich da an etwas erinnern zu können...

Schöne Sammler-Grüße aus Oberbayern,

Tom

Hello Klaus!
Thank you for the detailed treatise.
The reasoning sounds at least plausible ...
Now I am really curious and will go to my library in the evening.
I mean to remember something ...

Beautiful collector's greetings from Oberbayern,
 
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