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Thread: Help Identifying Luger pistol

  1. #1
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    Default Help Identifying Luger pistol

    Hello everyone, new member here. I recently acquired this pistol from my Wife’s late Grandfather’s collection- her grandmother decided to clean out his old collection. Supposedly, this gun was purchased sometime in the 1960s, other than that I know nothing about it.

    I’ve been reading about these pistols on the forum here for the past few days, and it seems like mine has very few markings in comparison to some others. Hopefully some of the experts on this site will impart me with a little knowledge. I have uploaded pictures of the pistol, and all obvious markings. Can anyone please help me identify this pistol?

    thanks in Advance!

  2. #2
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    The Crown above the "N" strike shows that it is a Commercial Luger pistol...not much else I can say...there are others on this forum who can help you out...WW1/Weimar era pistol, I believe...

  3. #3
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    Early 1930s police-used luger. Others can tell you about the grip strap marking which identifies the police organization that owned this luger. The magazine bottom should have some markings on it that may tell more of the story.
    The lack of a manufacturer's logo/mark on the top of this luger and the letter block of the serial number ("t") identifies this as a luger in that period when the old "DWM" logo stopped appearing on lugers and the Mauser identification had not yet appeared. Others may correct or elaborate this information. That is my understanding of these lugers which were once nicknamed "sneaks" because of the lack of a manufacturer's ID on the luger and because Germany was not supposed to be making new 9mm pistols at this time in accord with agreements post-WW1 and the Versailles Treaty.

    - - - Updated - - -

    You can see the police-required sear safety on the top of the left side/side plate. That was installed sometime in the 1930s. There also appears the left side slot where once there was a magazine safety that was removed as were most magazine safeties sometime before 1945.

  4. #4
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    David,
    That is a pretty good forensic analysis. I can't comment on it as I do not have any detailed knowledge of that period, but I bet you have sent the analysis down the right path. Good job.
    Ron
    If it is made after 1918...it is a reproduction.

  5. #5
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    L.Ka.9. on the grip strap was property mark of Landjägerei of Kassel inventoried as the ninth luger. Credit Don Maus, "History Writ in Steel" (an excellent resource for understanding the history of German police pistols).

  6. #6
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    Florida
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    Quote Originally Posted by holster collector View Post
    Early 1930s police-used luger. Others can tell you about the grip strap marking which identifies the police organization that owned this luger. The magazine bottom should have some markings on it that may tell more of the story.
    The lack of a manufacturer's logo/mark on the top of this luger and the letter block of the serial number ("t") identifies this as a luger in that period when the old "DWM" logo stopped appearing on lugers and the Mauser identification had not yet appeared. Others may correct or elaborate this information. That is my understanding of these lugers which were once nicknamed "sneaks" because of the lack of a manufacturer's ID on the luger and because Germany was not supposed to be making new 9mm pistols at this time in accord with agreements post-WW1 and the Versailles Treaty.

    - - - Updated - - -

    You can see the police-required sear safety on the top of the left side/side plate. That was installed sometime in the 1930s. There also appears the left side slot where once there was a magazine safety that was removed as were most magazine safeties sometime before 1945.
    Thanks! That was very helpful. Do you have any insight into what the stamp that appears to be an eagle with a “WZA66” beneath it on the right side of the receiver is for? Picture attached, also attaching pictures of the bottom of the magazine that was with the pistol. I was reading online about the proof stamps and it appears there an many variations.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #7
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    Iowa
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    Thanks to Ron for his gratious compliment. Thanks to Edward T. for mentioning the commercial Crown/N proof on the left side. The Crown/N proof stamp, typically found on commercial sales lugers, combined with the WzA66 inspection/acceptance stamp on the right side tell a story. I hope someone can fill in the story but I will speculate this luger might have been produced for commercial sales then redirected to a police or gov't customer resulting in the single inspection stamp (WzA66). Typical luger production involved multiple right side inspection and acceptance stamps, indicating the same contract customer had inspected the luger at multiple stages in production. With a single inspection/acceptance stamp, it may be that the production process was not under the gov't's control and the gov't stepped in to purchase the final luger after production. This is speculation on my part. The WzA abbreviation differs from typical military inspection abbreviation (WaA). Other abbreviations exist and I hope others can describe the Ar4 (early 1920s) and HzA abbreviations (occasionally) found.

    This is a transitional era in luger production with a variety of markings and stories. For example, in this era, there are lugers with the Crown/N proof that also have "7.65" crossed out on top of the luger. This probably indicates production as a 7.65 caliber commercial luger refitted to handle 9mm ammunition for police or military use. I mention police OR military use because Germany, limited by agreement to a 100,000 man military, had an enormous police force that could later be quickly adapted to military purposes. Some have suggested this was to circumvent treaty restrictions on the size of the military. There is a lot of interesting history hidden in these lugers.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChevelleSS View Post
    Thanks! That was very helpful. Do you have any insight into what the stamp that appears to be an eagle with a “WZA66” beneath it on the right side of the receiver is for? Picture attached, also attaching pictures of the bottom of the magazine that was with the pistol. I was reading online about the proof stamps and it appears there an many variations.

  8. #8
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    Oct 2015
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    Ohio, USA
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    Yes...it is/was a Police Luger...totally missed that sear safety on the left side of the pistol...shouldn't have...I own a few Police Mauser Banners from WW2 era...this time period is not really in my "wheelhouse"...but I was sure on the "Crown/N" Commercial strike...

    I apologize...

    Edward

  9. #9
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    Thanks so much to everyone! Looks like a have inadvertently gotten my hands on a peice of history. I surely never would have figured it out without this forum. If anyone has any further info about what the “WzA66” below the Eagle means, I would greatly appreciate it.

    again, thanks to everyone.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChevelleSS View Post
    Thanks so much to everyone! Looks like a have inadvertently gotten my hands on a peice of history. I surely never would have figured it out without this forum. If anyone has any further info about what the “WzA66” below the Eagle means, I would greatly appreciate it.

    again, thanks to everyone.
    If you do an advanced search with the words, Luger and "WzA66" , you will come up with only 5 links on the world-wide-web. None of those links will answer your question. But all of the guns were Weimar era police guns, if that helps. The only other one ever posted on this forum is as follows:

    https://luger.gunboards.com/showthre...ighlight=WzA66

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